Dear Tribe (NSA)

topic posted Fri, May 8, 2009 - 1:32 AM by 
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At this point in time, what can we do as users to help strengthen tribe and make it more successful ?
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  • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

    Fri, May 8, 2009 - 6:59 AM
    I can't speak for them, but it seems pretty obvious that social networks are about people, so get more people involved. Post compelling things, invite people back, and generally get the party started again.
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    Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

    Fri, May 8, 2009 - 8:04 AM
    Broaden tribe's appeal beyond burners and belly dancers, and redirect its content away from internet shut in losers whining hysterically about trolls and alts.

    You can't log onto this site without seeing at least one whining internet shut in loser going on about how he or she is going to call the FBI to report a troll or is going to sue a troll.

    That can't be good for business. It is a red flag to any sane person that they have entered the realm of the internet loser.
    • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

      Fri, May 8, 2009 - 9:55 AM
      Guru has become very proud of his little phrase "internet shut in loser." He think he has found a real wounding thing there. Problem is he fits the description to a T. As for "redirecting content" are you implying that you actually contribute any yourself?
      • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

        Fri, May 8, 2009 - 1:42 PM
        not for nothing;

        if you're looking in only public tribes you'll get the idea that person X is nothing more than a hated lout because all you'll see is chat between those that hate X and have made a career out of harassing and spreading rumors about X.

        Many have retreated to privacy in order to conduct their friendships and conversation, on both sides of the divide.

        It's really so much simpler than most of the involved parties make it out to be, in most of these cases - hipsters versus nerds.

        Those of us who are both in spades compose yet another phylum, and yes we have our own private tribes.

        That's probably *not* the best thing for tribe.net but it is the best thing for those who use it for more than a couple of years.

        The reality is that most of these people (*not* all - lord there really are some badly broken and scarily-obsessive people on these pages (and those of every similar service) but they're a tiny minority) suffer from *too much contact*.

        I can think of one situation in which the party most often claiming victimhood actually *follows* her "attacker* from page to page to and pokes, prods, toys with, provokes, annoys him endlessly. How is he 'trolling' her? It's insane. But, because he's notoriously provocative, any plea for sanity by him will be either regarded as a ploy or a failure on his part. He's hamstrung. What can he do? Nothing - except move the most valuable aspects of his discourse to private tribes she can't follow him into.

        In this way, his "victim" has actually robbed tribe.net of a funny, engaging, and often informative voice through constant tireless harassment, all while claiming she is defenseless against him and that he 'won't leave her alone'.

        This kind of behavior is, typically, not frowned upon unless someone who has been branded by the mainstream (read: vanilla) crowd.

        Tribe.net's fragmented personality has only grown more disjointed over time as a result. Its original concept is so buried under this dumb bullshit that most forget that it was revolutionary and ahead of the curve when it rolled out. I really think that mgmt has shot itself in the foot by focusing on teapot tempests.

        Taking sides is a monumentally stupid mistake that each successive wave of managers seems to be helpless to avoid making.

        This is why many of us who have been labeled have, over time, become jaundiced or even hostile toward the vanillas, and distrustful (to say the least) of mgmt that has, in the past, knee-jerked readily and consistently to agree with and enforce the vanillas' prejudices - despite the clear facts regarding number of clicks and frequency of returns to the site.



        11 Loki did pause, and did give himself to thought for some small time.

        12 Then Loki stood again, and did say unto the people,

        13 "If I had a dog that all the neighbors loved so much they put a dollar in my mailbox every time they passed my house, I would not flog that dog,

        14 ladies and gentlemen. I wouldn't let him bite people indiscriminately - oh no! - but neither

        15 would I be all that surprised if he took a vicious snap at the little asshole that comes by every few minutes to throw rocks at him."
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          Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

          Fri, May 8, 2009 - 6:03 PM
          Loki wrote:

          " I can think of one situation in which the party most often claiming victimhood actually *follows* her "attacker* from page to page to and pokes, prods, toys with, provokes, annoys him endlessly. How is he 'trolling' her? It's insane. But, because he's notoriously provocative, any plea for sanity by him will be either regarded as a ploy or a failure on his part. He's hamstrung. What can he do? Nothing - except move the most valuable aspects of his discourse to private tribes she can't follow him into.

          In this way, his "victim" has actually robbed tribe.net of a funny, engaging, and often informative voice through constant tireless harassment, all while claiming she is defenseless against him and that he 'won't leave her alone'.'

          ---of course, all the intelligent people who have been paying attention know that Loki is talking about how TRUE has stalked me.

          It is so sweet that Loki defends me even though I have been such a shit to him.

          If I was gay, the first thing I would want to do is move to New England and get married to Loki.

          Anyhow, my mission in life is to help people. My mission on tribe is to fuck with assholes.
  • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

    Fri, May 8, 2009 - 3:16 PM
    I spent a couple of weeks last year breaking down the trolls on Youtube who were swarming the 911 videos, and I got real familiar with the psychological tactics they use. Each "handle" actually represented a daisy chain of people who would relieve each other throughout the day and evening. After awhile, you could spot the changeover because the diction would change a bit. Sundays were prime time because there would be more people idling away Sunday afternoon and evening on the computer and the hit rate on Youtube videos would go up, so the trolls would go into overdrive slamming and spamming. Their task was to keep the first page of the "comments" always slanted towards the Official Story and away from what the video was so effectively depicting - that the Official Story was crap. Whoever handles this small army is obviously of the opinion that the first page of the "comments" which hangs there just below eye level while the video is playing will have influence on the perception of the video. They are probably right about that, and they invest significant resources in making sure that first page stays sanitized for their interests which are to try to prevent discovery and dissemination of evidence exposing the 911 plot.
    A troll could be made to snap sometimes and spill some beans. The general impression I finally gleaned was that many of them were military. Sone of them would let slip little nuggets that betrayed a Zionist slant or background sometimes. Their group whine or howl was that anytime a path leading to Israel or Mossad was found you were engaging in anitsemitism or were persecuting the "joos" another one of their group sarcasms. It is no surprise that many would be Israeli because it is the Likudists who were a big part of the 911 op and who would have a lot to lose if the op were publically busted. Of course, there were plenty of our own over here who were facilitators, so lots of heads could roll on both sides of the pond. "Twoofers" or "troofers" was these trolls favorite epithet. It was their "badge expression." I notice that "The Man" uses that expression too.
    Never once did i entertain the idea of reporting anyone to the FBI. What a ludicrous straw man observation that is. I have never seen anyone here do that either. People who lay around here whining about whiners really cannot be casting any stones. This is just a free for all here as it should be. If I call you a troll because I think you smell like one well ain't that just too bad. I am going to give it as good as you do. Let the games begin. I rarely use the troll word on tribe and I try to conduct myself with civility, but here and there one runs across posters who are just sitting around in "internet shut in loser" fashion idly slandering, jabbing, poking. That's fine. It's a still free country - sort of - and therefore I reserve the right to call down a troll or "professional disruptor" when I see one right or wrong. It doesn't really amount to a hill of beans one way or the other. It's not like we are addressing ourselves to a vast audience here guys.
    As for "strengthening" tribe, well, people get tired of things and move on. It's not just tribe losing participants. A lot of these social networking sites are dropping. Only problems I see with tribe are software related and not enough users kicking a little lucre their way to pay for the needed upgrades. I really doubt there is anything else that can be done to stem defections if that is occuring. Tribe has always been visually engaging and well designed. There is a well crafted illusion of presence and face to face engagement here that I dig. If people are leaving, well, you did your best. I'm not leaving and as far as I know I'm not even a member of a "belly dancing" or "burner" tribe either.
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      Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

      Fri, May 8, 2009 - 5:38 PM
      By 911 videos, do you mean the conspiracy theory nut case videos? God bless the trolls who challenged you there, and I laugh my ass off that they managed to take up two weeks out of your wasted life.

      Try science instead.
      • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

        Fri, May 8, 2009 - 8:26 PM
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          Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

          Fri, May 8, 2009 - 9:00 PM
          If this is valid science, how come no wrongful death lawsuits have been brought?

          I mean, shit goddamn, there's damn near nothing good for trial lawyers to work on these days.

          And three thousand dead at the hands of the US government, that's muder, that's a lot of lawsuits. Like the OJ civil lawsuit you know? There's a lot of money to be made in suing wealthy entities, like the government, if they kill your loved ones.

          Know why none have been brought?

          Cause your "science" is junk and can't get past a Daubert hearing.

          Don't know what Daubert means?

          Look it up, nerd.
          • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

            Fri, May 8, 2009 - 10:03 PM
            Wrongful death lawsuits:

            www.americanfreepress.net/html/...d.html
            • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

              Fri, May 8, 2009 - 10:06 PM
              The Judge Hellerstein con:
              www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin...hive.cgi
              • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                Sat, May 9, 2009 - 6:45 AM
                At this point in time.... what can we do to strengthen tribe and make it more successful?

                I think we need to get to work on the next great thing. Mirroring the little steps facebook et all take is fine, but its a recipe for stagnation overall.

                This internet thing is very very young. where is it going? how can we take simple radical steps to stay ahead of the curve?

                In thirty odd years, microsoft hasn't been able to 'buy' innovation. Tribe is small, but it has such a strong core with such a variety of personalities. Real conversations about what we can create together will produce amazing results.




                (ps, if you spend much energy making points against trolls, you become a troll)


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              Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

              Sun, May 10, 2009 - 6:49 PM
              Your cases can't survive an evidentiary challenge, because you have no admissible evidence, because your conspiracy theories are unsupported by the facts and your experts are hacks engaged in unreliable junk science.

              You have the burden of proof. Unlike the internet, where nut jobs like you demand that we prove you wrong, in a court, the proponent of a theory bears the burden of proof. You nut jobs can't prove your case.

              End of case. Case dismissed. With prejudice.
              • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                Sun, May 10, 2009 - 6:59 PM
                May you Mr. Guru, one day be fated to be at the mercy of a court so prejudiced and irresponsible.
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                  Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                  Mon, May 11, 2009 - 6:41 AM
                  Application of the rules of evidence does not make a court "prejudiced" and "irresponsible."

                  You conspiracy nutcases hold these imaginary trials in your head, where you are the judge, jury and executioner. In these trials, you are able to take one tiny, irrelevant bit of evidence or some totally inconsequential contradiction, and inflate that mere scintilla of evidence into an entire case.

                  Naturally, when you fools enter a real courtroom, which is rare 'cause you are mostly just a bunch of wing nuts who know better, you lose and blame your loss on the judge and court system being rigged, which you claim is further evidence of a conspiracy.

                  There's no conspiracy. You're just losers. It is the natural order of things for losers to lose.
          • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

            Fri, May 22, 2009 - 2:56 PM
            What's that? A Dilbert hearing? I never heard of that.
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              Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

              Fri, May 22, 2009 - 4:04 PM
              LOL!. Rendall, that is hilarious.

              Often times they do resemble Dilbert, but no, a Daubert hearing is one in which a judge dismisses a 911 conspiracy theory nutcase's lawsuit because his metallurgy expert, it turns out, does indeed have a Ph.D, but it is in African-American studies rather than mechanical engineering, chemistry or metallurgy. Nothing wrong with African-American studies, that's a worthy and important subject, but it is not relevant to the subject matter upon which the expert intends to testify.

              So the court rules the expert is not qualifed to offer the expert testimony on what temperature steel melts at, and without that, the plaintiff can't prove his case and so another junk lawsuit is dismissed from the court system.

              I do like that you called it a Dilbert hearing. I'm gonna use that next time.
              • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                Fri, May 22, 2009 - 6:45 PM
                Ethan the Revolutionary War Furniture Dude says:

                >>Broaden tribe's appeal beyond burners and belly dancers, and redirect its content away from internet shut in losers whining hysterically >>about trolls and alts.

                I'm not sure I agree with the first part, necessarily. Tribe's unique appeal is precisely (or used to be) its counterculture edge--this is what makes it not facebook and etc. There are a lot of smart, interesting and strange people here--even still.

                The second part about what content the newbie sees right off is absolutely on the mark. It's just a bad idea for the unwary to click on "High Folks" (recently posted topics), or just about anything that goes on in this "brainstorming" tribe, (unless by brainstorming, you mean 'headbanging'). I've consistently had much more intelligent, rational discussions with homeless people and schizophrenics than most of what goes on in this tribe--which is the second most active after the Burning Man tribe (which is equally bizarre in its own way. OK Ethan, I see your point). The most active tribes aren't discussions, they're ongoing symptoms. This thread is a perfect example. How is it that people find themselves incapable of responding in this thread to Ethan's perfectly reasonable point? There are ways to disagree that aren't bizarre acting out of whatever your childhood issues happen to be. Or do you people think 'brainstorm' means 'the crazy lightning bolts shooting through my skull and raining uncontrollably out through my twitching fingers?"

                NSA folk, you're pushing front page content based on activity, rather than quality--technical simplicity rather than thoughtful consideration of actual value. Frequent activity bears no relation whatsoever to quality--try wading through the LolitaXXX porn downloads on a Bittorrent site looking for that French New Wave movie you can't find anywhere else, for example.

                It would be much better to have a human editor choosing the sort of content that would actually attract the sort of intelligent, edgy, interesting, artistic people that made tribe what it used to be in the first place. I'm not sure how to choose that content. Last time this idea was floated, people didn't like the idea of flagging each other's content, even to praise it. It might be reasonable for NSA to actually pay somebody (even an intern) that would take the time, familiarize themselves with the truly quality thought, creative writing and art that still goes on here, and perhaps, after asking permission, feature the content--perhaps a good image, a good post, or an actually rational discussion--and maybe change it once a week or so. This is labor-intensive, but not that bad, for one person to do. And content editors aren't as expensive as coders.

                You may now resume your regularly scheduled cannibalistic character assassinations and symptomatic frothing.

  • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

    Fri, May 8, 2009 - 8:52 PM
    This is some tired ass shit thread. The initial thread post is quite fucking valid. Thank you Bloke. And no I didnt read every word on the thread and scanned it really fuckin fast. DUH!!! But the initial question is the total fucking shiznit unt crust of the bizquit!!!

    BOINK!!!

    And no. No negative bullshit is required of the outspoken negative sewage mongers.

    Thank you

    Goodbye
    • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

      Sun, May 10, 2009 - 8:18 AM
      Some respondents have value.

      Others do not.

      Let's all use our powers of judgment, and trust our fellow tribe.net users to do the same.



      I'm confident that most people will tend to agree with me on who is and isn't worth reading.
      • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

        Tue, May 12, 2009 - 9:27 PM
        <Let's all use our powers of judgment, and trust our fellow tribe.net users to do the same. >

        I would be particularly interested if Tribe responded
        • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

          Tue, May 12, 2009 - 9:59 PM
          1. Post -- blogs, threads, photos, listings, reviews, etc. Reviews are especially good for driving traffic.
          2. Invite people
          3. Subscribe

          And...
          4. Don't flood the help desk with requests to remove things that offend you.
          5. Use your powers of judgment and trust your fellow tribe.net users to do the same.
          • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

            Tue, May 12, 2009 - 11:01 PM
            What's
            tha current
            tribe membership
            stats?
            • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

              Tue, May 12, 2009 - 11:31 PM
              <Reviews are especially good for driving traffic>

              That is good to know... maybe we should get organised and do that ?
              • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                Wed, May 13, 2009 - 12:33 AM
                Yes, I was thinking about offering incentives for local reviews again, I know in the past they offered amazon gift certificates if we reviewed some significant number of things.

                I hadn't run stats in a while (the db fragility keeps me busy and makes me wary of running long queries... ) but in March-April we were getting about 5000 active users a day just after the move (when the site was very unstable) and ramped up to about 7500 per day towards the end of April.
                • Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                  Wed, May 13, 2009 - 12:59 AM
                  <I was thinking about offering incentives for local reviews again>

                  You never know Carolyn.. people might just be willing to do it with no reward beyond tribes success.

                  And it is also problematic sending gift certs to folk like me who love tribe but dont live in the US..
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                  Re: Dear Tribe (NSA)

                  Wed, May 13, 2009 - 1:33 AM
                  Fix the reviews so they show the current ones, and not ones from the 18th century on the main page. That would truly help.

                  Another tie-in to that could be opinions. Like epinions. I thought I could review products in the reviews, and I couldn't (I only tried once, a year or two ago). Things that are SO GOOD that I really want to share that with other people. Like my can opener. It's so good I want to tell everyone about it. I wrote a blog about it ages ago. But that's not the same as having opinions/reviews show up in my profile. Which would also show up in Google searches, right? And is a good thing for Google ads, because it can promote the very can opener next to my review of my can opener. LOL!

                  People don't need gift certificates to gush about things they love (or things that break, or they hate, or gave them food poisoning). They need the opportunity to do it. And that knowledge is then shared with others who seek that kind of knowledge.

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